You're Playing Us Too Close
A young American acquaintance, currently residing and going to school in Paris, complained on her Facebook page today about all the inconvenience the demonstrations are to her busy schedule. She thinks the French need to "get over it". She is a typical, intelligent young woman with zero class consciousness, zero politics (aside from some liberal posturing) and zero sense of history or the crisis of our times. In other words, All Right! She was a young American!
Here in the Homeland, 159,000 public sector jobs were lost in September as local, state, and Federal workers (the last unionized workers) become "products" of budget cuts. 64,000 private sector jobs were created (half of what is required just to keep up with population growth) but 34,000 of these are low paying, weak or no benefit service sector jobs. Who will attend Jon Stewarts Return To Sanity Rally on the Washington Mall? I expect a Volvo-driving, latte-drinking crowd willing to listen to the same platitudes about moderation and consensus in the middle. Their portfolios are looking much better and their children ensconsed in good schools.
The truly audacious thing about Obama is the way he has implemented a turbo-charged Clinton-Blair-like attack on Labor, (especially teachers), the very Democrat-faithfuls who worked so hard to get him elected. His mistake was thinking this would appease the Right when in fact it has only emboldened them, given them Hope.It seems not to matter how much he embraces the War on Terror or ignores climate change, the Right still dreams of that government -drowning bathtub. The stock market soars and the houses foreclose and the American working-class takes out it's anger on gays and mosques and fruit pickers.And the French!
Meanwhile, my ballot shows up in the mail and I face the dilemna; fill in the little boxes and legitimize the whole ridiculous farce or throw it in the garbage and have Tea Partiers run the county for a few years. I could write-in Ann Coulters tits, one for Senate and one for the House!
I proposed earlier that voting for the stupidest, gun-toting Libertarian would be the most expedient route to utter chaos and then,perhaps, positive change. The question is, how long would people sit isolated on their private property,chewing on roots and berries, holding their guns, finally "free"?
posted by troutsky @ 7:33 AM
44 comments
44 Comments:
Might as well give them a shot. Ask yourself, could they possibly fuck things up any worse than Democrats and mainstream Republicans have already? You know, those career politicians who have so much more "experience" than the Tea Party candidates haven't exactly made all that so-called experience count for a hell of a lot, have they?
Its obvious the woman in question is smarter than you. Class warfare is an idea for political criminals and
losers.
You should be grateful to Obama. If we had a real President there would be Contras disposing of the War Criminal in Caracas.
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No class warfare, Trout !!!
Just eat what the fucking invisible hand puts on the plate.
Watch it though, if you've been following the latest mortgage saga, the invisible hand has sticky fingers again.
Ducky
Why not vote with your feet and emigrate. Hugo needs you to replace all the professionals that left.
You need to follow the courage of your convictions.
The class war is against the working class.
I agree with you, that the teachers union is hit the hardest. In Minneapolis in the Northside Afro American neighborhood, all the public schools are closed or closing soon.
The difference between the US and France, is the labor parties.
Ren
You can fantasize all you want about class warfare. However, the grass roots is speaking and it is not going your way. There is finally a movement that commies can not infiltrate and subvert.
You could be getting a visit from the FBI any moment. Pack your bags and run before you do hard time.
@Beak -- Why not vote with your feet and emigrate. Hugo needs you to replace all the professionals that left.
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Well, it's like this, Beak. I look around and see this nutlog in New York who's going bonkers over "men in speedos", we got the butthead in Nevada who thinks part of the country is already under Sharia, Sturmbannfuhrer Iott in Ohio likes to dress as a Nazi, in Delaware they're rerunning "Bewitched".
Then you have "Baby Doc" Rand in Kentucky and just so many others. You think I'm going to move and mss the floor show?
Meanwhile, I tank up at Citgo whenever I'm empty.
"Baby Doc" has got my vote.
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I would expect so, Pagan, but it puzzles me why you run from the Libertarian label.
Beak, more from the floor show:
Glen Urquhart (candidate for the House from Del.): "The exact phrase 'separation of Church and State' came out of Adolph HItler's mouth, that's where it comes from. So the next time your liberal friends talk about the separation of Church and State, ASK THEM WHY THEY'RE NAZIS."
(maybe he should ask the guy in Ohio)
Carl Paladino (Bagger candidate for NY Gov.) on housing poor people in prisons: "THESE ARE BEAUTIFUL PROPERTIES with basketball courts, bathroom facilities, toilet facilities. Many young people would love to get the hell out of cities"
Kristi Noem (Republican candidate for the House from S. Dakota) on driving (she has received 30 tickets and multiple arrest warrants for skipping court): "OBVIOUSLY, I'M NOT PROUD OF MY DRIVING RECORD, but I've been working hard to be a better example to young kids and young drivers out there."
trout, Weimar Germany on the way?
I don't run from the Libertarian label. Like with everything else, I pick out what I like and discard the rest. There's more to like than to dislike, but there's still enough to dislike to keep me from being able to call myself Libertarian.
Ask yourself, could they possibly fuck things up any worse than Democrats and mainstream Republicans have already?
The simple answer to this question is, YES, they COULD! The worst mistake you can make in analyzing these situations is to assume that it cannot get worse. It can. It can always get much worse. I'm sure a lot of middle class Germans who voted Hitler into power thought, "Oh, he's nutty and rants about the Jews, but can he really make things worse..?"
All Right! She was a young American!
I'm not even a Bowie fan, but I can sing along! Do you remember, your President Nixon? You bet I do!
Personally, I think Obama has done some good things, limited though they are. I think he's a smart well-meaning guy. I think he might be planning to bail out of Afghanistan, which is the right thing to do.
I also think he is way too close to the big money guys - they fill his inner circle. And I don't know whether he's naive or just conservative, or what - he's not dumb - but he just doesn't seem to get whom he's dealing with in the Republican party.
Oh for the days of FDR, a real traitor to his class, who said of the venom spat at him by Wall Street, "I welcome their hatred." Whoa, patrician liberal snoot, but he knew where he stood and what he needed to do...to save capitalism!
Ducky
The ball game is over Obama killed the left for 20 tears.
Beak: You should be grateful to Obama. If we had a real President there would be Contras disposing of the War Criminal in Caracas.
Rule by the gun.
Troutsky: The IWW here has organized the first union election of a fast food restaurant. The big news is that it has AFL-CIO support.
Pagan: Duckys point, that our parliamentary system has passed the point of farce, is what leads me to cynically advocate voting for the most clueless ideologue on the ballot. ( in our local case, people who call themselves Libertarians)
Now as Lichanos and my wife wisely point out, this has been known to go very badly and certainly could again. People will get hurt, mostly poor or the Other.
But they are being hurt regardless and certainly will continue to be.
I identify as a liberal, minimal state socialist. I also think Hugo Chavez is trying to spread power throughout neglected sectors of society but is hindered in this effort by reactionaries like Beak.
Notice how quickly the ruling class and it's scabs use the term "class warfare" as a pejorative as they wage it relentlessly themselves. I say Bring it On!
Hugo is a perfect example of an unqualified person running a country, so at least you're consistent. What's he done besides engage in anti-US demagoguery and vitriol, and redistribute wealth, or try to? His country is a basket case. Can you imagine if those trapped miners had been there instead of Chile'? He would have spent most of his time accusing the US of sabotage. He probably would have sent word to them that they should keep working while they was down there and if they were lucky maybe they would eventually dig themselves out. Then he would have hyped them as heroes of the revolution who kept working for the good of the Bolivarian cause in the face of intense hardship due to US imperialism and CIA sabotage.
I put him on the same level as Hitler. Men of former minor authority and otherwise questionable qualifications with a gift for gab propped up by anti-establishment forces. You know, kind of like Obama.
I should also remind you that the whole impetus behind the Tea Party, and presumably the candidates they support, is not to "rule", but to return to following the constitution in the form of limited government. That's why one shouldn't worry unduly about negative effects.
The purpose of America's government has become perverted, and that's the major cause of most of our problems. The government was never meant to "rule" the people, nor was it meant to be the "servant of the people", it was meant simply to follow the constitution.
As such, it has a duty to provide for a stable atmosphere with sensible oversight of the economy, and otherwise stay out of the way. It has an obligation to protect our borders and protect from foreign aggression. And of course it has a duty to uphold the rights of all its citizens as delineated in the Bill of Rights. Outside of that, nada, nothing, zilch.
As far as class warfare goes, Democrats do this as naturally as one draws breath. I say this knowing you don't particularly care for Democrats any more than I do, but there it is. They engage in racial politics, gender politics, anything that amounts to divide and conquer. They're a mess. Republicans have their faults, granted, but basically all Republican voters want is to be left alone to live their lives without interference from government mandates. For all their problems, that in itself puts them on a level sky high above Damnocrats. Unfortunately, the Republican Party is their one and only option.
Hugo is a perfect example of an unqualified person running a country...
I am not a Hugo fan, but I question the substance of your comment. Do you have anything to say about what he does in Venezuela, or do you only care about his attention grabbing soundbites directed at us? Was GWB more qualified??
...but basically all Republican voters want is to be left alone to live their lives without interference from government mandates...
Sounds like the Clint Eastwood political philosophy: "Everybody should leave everybody along." Okay, great. But then there are those schools, and roads, and the army for heavens sake, and who's going to supply this and that...And all those Republicans want their social security and medicare checks...
So what does that philosophy amount to? Sounds like my 17 year old son - "Just leave me ALONE...Dad, I need $20."
Lichanos
Your comparison of GWB to Hugo Chavez shows that you are merely marginally smarter than the rest of the special ed class.
Cappo Ren
A Trotskyite thug knows all about ruling from the gun. Hugo's henchmen and criminal mobs are well versed in crime.
It is time to Arm contras and finish off Chavez. The contras should target foreign supporters of Chavez on revolutionary tours first. Let foreign supporters of a criminal regime come home in boxes.
Beak: Give me one example of Chavez to rule by the gun?
Ever hear of El Caracazo moron?
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Can you imagine if those trapped miners had been there instead of Chile'?
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They weren't Pagan, so speculation is useless although this type of statement is a standard fallacy of the right.
But let's play. Can you imagine if Massey Energy owned the Chilean mine.
Now, why was this mine open after a series of problems and a serious recent cave in? They're already starting with the mouth music about enforcing regulations.
Meanwhile, the Atacama desert is filled with crosses of dead miners, miners beaten to death by the owners thugs, miners killed for trying to organize.
The struggle is eternal.
Ren, I don't think Beak is aware that Chavez lost his veto proof majority after the recent election. No violence and no accusations of widespread irregularities.
I'm not sure where Beak gets his news.
Beak also has not responded to queries about his position on Chavez reducing poverty in Venezuela.
"I put him on the same level as Hitler. Men of former minor authority and otherwise questionable qualifications with a gift for gab propped up by anti-establishment forces. You know, kind of like Obama."
Pagan
Just about sums up the landscape, politically, don't ya think? And given your summation, I would say politics IS the problem. Hierarchical domination of any temperament is unacceptable for us or the planet!
"And given your summation, I would say politics IS the problem. Hierarchical domination of any temperament is unacceptable for us or the planet!"
The problem is, people naturally gravitate towards "leaders", and there are more than a few willing to take up the mantle, usually for all or mostly the wrong reasons, which boils down to power.
A really advanced society, in my opinion, is one in which people are taught at least some degree of self-reliance, from the earliest of ages, while still gravitating that fine line of recognition of societal needs for cooperation.
There will always be some kind of hierarchy, for there will always be a need for one, especially during emergency situations, otherwise you would have nothing but constant chaos.
But on the other hand, the constant drive of some to put their faith in the beneficence of authority of any stripe is going backwards, not forwards by any stretch of the imagination.
Nature Boy KKKulture Clown revives from his peyote stupor. If there is a single person on the planet who is more divorced from reality is Tarzan Krolic leading us into a Mazola Marxism fantasy of hunter gatherers.
The fact that real hunter gathers are super violent except in comparison to Communist Hacks like Capo Ren is just a detail. Swing through trees, live shorter communal lives and kill the folks in rival bands as a survival strategy all brought to you by Tarzan Krolic.
The clown Ren feigns ignorance over Chavez's use of FARC, Hezbollah and criminal gangs to do his dirty work. Commies play this plausible deniability game all the time.
We need regime change in Caracas. Offer Chavez asylum in France and it will be done. His war crimes commited against the people of Colombia warrant an invasion.
Why the fascination with Chavez, Pagan? I'd ask Beak but I don't believe he'd answer without drooling.
You want "freedom" (whatever that is) and see Chavez as enemy number one.
Now who represents a larger threat to your freedom, Chavez or the Koch bros(look it up, Beak)?
Your choice of Chavez seems arbitrary, maybe because he's one of the few who have resisted our coups. He played tougher than Honduras and others. I'm not sure.
Ducky
Obama gets tossed out and Chavez goes
next. His games with funding terrorists and spreading his evil are over.
The USA, Colombia and possibly Guyana invade. Chavez is hung up like Mussolini and his carcass is fed to dogs.
The only reason I mentioned Chavez is Troutsky brought him up in his comment, on a post about how Tea-Party candidates are allegedly unqualified. I don't see Chavez as enemy number one. I'm not even sure I'd put him in the top ten. He's just a nut who happens to be in charge of a country.
Pagan
"He's just a nut who happens to be in charge of a country.".. you mean like Saakashvilli (look it up Beak!!), like Akhmedinijhad, like Sarcozy, like the scores of others who advance themselves at the expense of their 'followers'while claiming to advance the desires of those they enslave.
"There will always be some kind of hierarchy, for there will always be a need for one, especially during emergency situations, otherwise you would have nothing but constant chaos."
I agree that it is important for people to have exemplary models from which to learn (tribal elders who advise); but institutional, hierarchical leadership is a relatively modern invention, coming into being with the birth of city states, and empire building... (sorry Beak, I just can't help myself!!)
But, I think you and I agree, Pagan, that more egalitarian self-reliance within an integrated social network would be best.
Kultur said
But, I think you and I agree, Pagan, that more egalitarian self-reliance within an integrated social network would be best.
What about an egalitarian, integrated social network where one was free to rely on oneself or choose to rely on a collective or some combination thereof.
But either way one had the capacity and power to determine ones own fate?
The process of integration/ mediation I call politics. Expression of ones interest within the network. Politics as such would not be a "problem" in this system but capitalist hierarchy sure would be!
Troutsky
I am thinking about a nonreflective, naturally occurring network based upon kinship relations... it is called a tribe or a clan. There is nothing political or calculating about it; and it is an egalitarian arrangement where everyone has a right to decide for themselves what to do... but there is a council of elders to provide advice and direction.
I know you dislike capitalism, as I do; but what political framework can you point to historically that was non-hierarchical?
Kultur,
Old Testament ethics are based on the clan. They apply within the clan and outsiders are fair game.
My take, find a way to enlarge the clan. Hence my dislike of Libertarianism which shrinks the clan.
@Ducky:
Hence my dislike of Libertarianism which shrinks the clan.
On the other hand, there's nationalism, which expands the clan. Either way, as you note, anyone outside the boundary is fair game.
I think tribalism sucks. Some of our favorite oligarchies, including the Roman Empire, were and are based on kinship. Not to mention the all-time favorite kinship organization, the mafia.
I don't see much of a positive future for that political direction.
Post-civ.. nothing is really possible
For those of you unfamiliar with the pre-civilized role of tribes and their value in social cohesiveness without a tendency to violence, see Morton Fried, The Evolution of Political Society.
Troutsky
With your claim to be focused on political solutions, I am surprised you still have not looked at this book by Fried... I trust you to be smarter than to ignore it.
Strike up the music and don the loin cloths, not Capo Ren for aesthetic regions. All of you shall follow Tarzan Krolic into Paradise Never Was.
Never before in the history of man has someone ever displayed such an active imagination. No doubt playing Tarzan and hanging out with apes is preferable to any gathering of hygienically challenged Trotskyites as apes do know how to groom and are better behaved.
In fact why has Tarzan Krolic not taken his theory to its apex. If communists like Ren lived like Apes they would be more civilized and peaceful. Kultur needs to go back past hunter gathers and go straight to apes. Selecting subhuman Trotskyites to live as apes is prudent because they do not posses intelligence and have no lives.
Beak, your Tourettes is acting up again. Please consult your physician.
Lichanos, yes, nationalism doesn't offer much, if anything. I had hoped that the environmental movement could bring a wider unity but that voice can barely be heard.
How to make the clan structure something more than the intro to 2001: A Space Odyssey (like most color Kubrick, an over rated film)?
Ducky: Beak not only is not capable of logical thought; worse is that his main trait is lying and evading. His world is black and white, with conspiracies everywhere. From Beak you can learn Ned Lamont's cousin is in the Communist Party.
The Chilean mine episode, shouldn't have occured period. There was warnings.
Beak: If the FBI raided my group, they'd find links to the British Labour Party.
"Beak: If the FBI raided my group, they'd find links to the British Labour Party."
At which point the agent in charge would say "put that shit down, we're looking for stuff we didn't know about."
Ren
Your comments say more about a lack of intelligence from the Labor Party
than about your group of questionably funded imbeciles who might be working with foreign intelligence.
KKKulture
Why stop at hunter gathers and not just go back to apes. Have you ever seen an ape that was alienated. We can go back to baboons. Baboons are an evolutionary step forward for commies.
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